Protecting Washington’s Parks and Wildlife: A Conversation with Dr. Andrea Thorpe

Washington’s state parks are more than just beautiful places to hike, camp, and explore—they’re critical habitats for some of the region’s most endangered species. From the windswept beaches of the Pacific Coast to hidden prairie remnants in Eastern Washington, these public lands quietly support vital conservation efforts that often go unnoticed.

Dr. Andrea Thorpe, Natural Resource Program Manager for Washington State Parks, plays a key role in protecting these fragile ecosystems. Her work spans everything from endangered shorebirds like the snowy plover—nesting right on our sandy beaches—to safeguarding habitats that support over 40% of the state’s threatened or endangered species.

Originally from Oregon, Andrea’s lifelong curiosity about nature has grown into a career rooted in science, stewardship, and public service. Her passion for Washington’s natural diversity is evident in her deep knowledge of landscapes, wildlife, and lesser-known parklands across the state. Whether she’s talking about the rough-skinned newt or recommending hidden island escapes, Andrea brings a fresh perspective to the importance of preserving these special places.

As beach season approaches, it’s more important than ever to respect posted closures and keep pets leashed—especially in snowy plover nesting zones. Small actions from visitors can make a lasting difference in protecting wildlife for future generations.

Explore the wild side of Washington’s state parks and gain new appreciation for the people working hard behind the scenes to keep them thriving.

Andrea Thorpe Washington State Parks Episode Transcript

Hello, friends, and welcome to the Exploring Washington State podcast. My name is Scott Cowan, and I’m the host of the show. Each episode, I have a conversation with an interesting guest who is living in or from Washington State. These are casual conversations with real and interesting people. I think you’re gonna like the show. So let’s jump right in with today’s guest. Alright. My guest today is Andrea Thorpe, PhD.

Scott Cowan [00:00:29]:

I’m gonna I’m gonna throw in the PhD because I wanna talk to you about that. And you are the natural resource program manager for Washington State Parks. So welcome.

Andrea Thorpe [00:00:37]:

Thank you, Scott. Thanks for having me.

Scott Cowan [00:00:41]:

PhD. You got that in Montana?

Andrea Thorpe [00:00:44]:

I did in Missoula.

Scott Cowan [00:00:46]:

In Missoula. I’d like you to really quickly before we start talking about you and Olympia in the state parks and all that, How did you end up here? What’s the what’s the backstory? What what what prompted you to go down this educational and career path?

Andrea Thorpe [00:01:06]:

Oh, man. I really have my parents to to thank for that. I grew up in a small farming and logging town down in Oregon, and, I wouldn’t say my parents were huge outdoors people, but they took us on annual vacations to a state park out on the coast, and I got to wander around and wander around tide pools and look at all the organisms there. They took us to the aquaria. They took us on hikes, and I just I had a natural affinity and love of nature, and, it just seemed natural that that would be what ended up being my career, even though as a kid, I didn’t really know what that would mean. And then I ended up, getting my first, my first degree down at Oregon State University, in a very kind of hands on applied ecology type of program, and I was really grateful as a new program there, and I was really grateful for the professors who were there and who were engaged and really invested in helping me and, you know, the others in my cohort succeed. And, from there, I went down to San Diego State University to pursue a master’s degree and then to University of Montana, go, Grizz, for my PhD. And, yeah, from there, I had a couple of different jobs, you know, in roughly speaking in the natural resources ecology field, but, a lot of it really stemmed from, yeah, being a kid who was encouraged to, you know, ask why and pursue her passion.

Andrea Thorpe [00:02:56]:

And, my mom is more than happy to tell you she doesn’t like snakes or worms, but she let me go ahead and play in the dirt and poke at snakes and worms and bugs and and all those things, which, I’m really grateful for.

Scott Cowan [00:03:13]:

Now the way you said it, did you have sibling do you have siblings?

Andrea Thorpe [00:03:18]:

I have an older brother.

Scott Cowan [00:03:19]:

What did he go into?

Andrea Thorpe [00:03:21]:

He, is in, I he’s a computer guy. He he’s a coder. Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:03:31]:

So he he went the other way?

Andrea Thorpe [00:03:34]:

Yes. If you will.

Scott Cowan [00:03:35]:

That’s interesting. It’s just interesting. Right? It’s just to me, it’s fascinating. So so you grew up in Oregon, bachelor’s from Oregon State. So go Ducks. No. Just kidding. Sorry.

Scott Cowan [00:03:43]:

Go Beavs. You went to San Diego State, which when we were talking on the phone before I was, you know, kind of joking with you, was it hard to leave San Diego? Mhmm. And and you surprised me in in you said it was harder to leave Montana, that you you liked you liked Montana. Mhmm. And now you’re now you’re here and you’re in the Olympia area and you’re working for the Washington State Parks Department. So how we were introduced was I received a press release about helping to protect the snowy plover. And did I pronounce that right? Plover? Plover? Okay. Plover.

Scott Cowan [00:04:17]:

And I gotta be honest with you. The word snowy, and then I see pictures of beach. It I’m I’m struggling with this disconnect. But when I was doing a little very little little research, I did not realize that these are an endangered species.

Andrea Thorpe [00:04:33]:

Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:04:34]:

So I I guess we should talk about that first because that was the initial conversation. We’re gonna go elsewhere. But what’s your involvement with this program, and why don’t you explain to my audience what they should be looking out for and what they can do to help, protect this this endangered species?

Andrea Thorpe [00:04:55]:

Yeah. Thank you. So, snowy plovers, they are unlike what the name suggests. They are species that exist in, on the beaches, in Oregon, Washington, and California actually. And, the birds are a state endangered and a federally threatened species, and they require open sand dune habitat which is really rare these days because we’ve, we introduced European beach grass that that tall, big thick grass that forms those big dunes on the beaches, that’s actually not native to, to our state and it’s really changed the habitat. And because of that, there are a lot of species that are actually rare, because of that habitat loss. And when the ones that’s been most impacted is the Snowy Plover. And, what I don’t know how many people know, but Washington State Parks manages the majority of the beaches in Washington State that are south of the Olympic National Park boundary.

Andrea Thorpe [00:06:04]:

And so that means that we are responsible for managing and protecting the the way plovers that are on Washington state’s beaches. And so, we work with our sister agency, the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife to conduct surveys for the Plovers each year and find out where it is that they’re nesting. They nest actually right in the beach in the sand. They don’t fly up in trees and make nests like a lot of other birds do. Instead, they make little indents in the sand and that’s where they lay their eggs directly in the sand. They’re colored the same color of sand, that’s how they hide them from predators. And so, you know, you wouldn’t see one until you’re practically stepping on it and yeah. And so because of that, we find out where they’re nesting and we mark them off with fence posts around that habitat.

Andrea Thorpe [00:06:54]:

And what we ask is that people really respect those closures. Not only is it marked off so that people can’t drive through those areas, but we ask that people don’t hike or walk through them. They don’t ride their bikes and, that they keep their dogs from running through those areas. And so that’s a really important thing. The the plovers are out there nesting this time of year. They start nesting in the spring and then those closures last throughout the summer. And, yeah, our our just big ask as the public is if they see those plover closure areas that they respect them and, do what they can to help, help these poor little birds thrive. If you’re lucky, you’ll see them out there.

Andrea Thorpe [00:07:36]:

The Plovers, they’re really small, little brown and white birds. Their babies are adorable. The chicks look like little tiny cotton balls on little toothpicks for legs, scurrying about in the in the on the sand. You, you know, you’d be surprised that they’re not getting blown around by wind. But, yeah, it it it’s it’s actually really special that we are providing habitat for this species and that, we’ve seen a few increases in the last couple years, but, there’s they’re really rare. And so we’re trying to do everything we can to to protect them.

Scott Cowan [00:08:12]:

One of the things I’ve got this article up from on parks.gov. And so the birds weigh about two ounces. So they’re they’re, you know, very lightweight, maybe six inches long, so the babies are gonna be really, really tiny. Mhmm. Is there so you since the parks department manages basically from South of the Olympic National Forest, What beach areas are we talking about? Are we talking all the way, you know, from all the way down the

Andrea Thorpe [00:08:40]:

the coast? Or There’s some concentrations of the birds. So, some of the areas near Griffiths Priday State Park and the Cook Palace Beach area. Excuse me. Some areas around, Midway Beach and, in Grayland State Park and then around the Ledbetter Peninsula area.

Scott Cowan [00:09:01]:

Okay. And since he’s been endangered now for, math is hard for me, some forty four years approximately. Over forty. I’ve I’m gonna just no math for Scott. Just over forty years. That’s that’s a long time to be on on you know, which is good that they’re still on it, which means that they’re not extinct. And you said you’re starting to see a little bit of an uptick. Is that even though the show is only about Washington state, but if you’re mentioning you mentioned Oregon and Northern California, are you talking to people in those states? Are they experiencing a notice not a noticeable are they are they seeing an improvement too?

Andrea Thorpe [00:09:39]:

No. And and by uptick, I guess, what I mean is that we see them trying to nest in areas that they haven’t been in before in part because we’ve managed to restore their habitat, but the success rate of those nests is still really low in part because of the disturbance that that we’re seeing. And, they’re they’re kind of just maintaining and holding on. We we aren’t really seeing a a large increase in the numbers of the species.

Scott Cowan [00:10:11]:

Okay. So they’re they’re not really improving. They’re they’re hanging on. Okay. And how how the public when we’re out and enjoying the beaches can can help is to just basically give them a wide berth. Don’t let the dogs run through it. They’re small. Why do you know why the name Snowy Plover? How do we because, I mean, I’m I’m hung up on this beach

Andrea Thorpe [00:10:36]:

stand. You know?

Scott Cowan [00:10:38]:

The sandy plover would work. I wouldn’t put the Snowy Plover.

Andrea Thorpe [00:10:42]:

Oh, that’s a good question. I don’t know. I really don’t know.

Scott Cowan [00:10:46]:

That’s fine. That’s right. What other endangered species are the parks department looking at in trying to protect that you’re aware of these days?

Andrea Thorpe [00:11:01]:

We have, we support habitat for several both state and globally threatened, rare species. We have at Fort Casey State Park, we actually have a population of a rare plant species that was recently removed from the endangered species list because, we’ve been successful in introducing a bunch more populations of that species. We also have a bunch of rare ecosystems in our parks. For instance, our state parks in the, like, kind of Lower Puget Sound area, we all and then moving north, but we provide, protection for almost all of the remaining low to mid elevation old growth forest that remains in the state of Washington. Yeah. I could I’ve got a list, that’s several pages long of kind of our our rare species and our rare habitats, and that’s that’s one of the things that is actually pretty special and I think relatively unknown about state parks. Most people think about them as these great places for recreation when in fact we’re we’re really pretty special. Over 40% of our parks provide habitat for state or globally threatened species.

Andrea Thorpe [00:12:25]:

So we’re managing to do that while we’re also providing for these great recreational opportunities for people.

Scott Cowan [00:12:33]:

Just wanna make sure I heard you correctly. Did you say 40% of the state parks have some protected or endangered habitat. That’s Mhmm. That’s almost half. I mean, that’s that’s striking to me.

Andrea Thorpe [00:12:48]:

Yeah. Wow.

Scott Cowan [00:12:50]:

We’re we’re

Andrea Thorpe [00:12:50]:

kind of a low key big deal.

Scott Cowan [00:12:53]:

Okay. How did you how did you land at the state park system?

Andrea Thorpe [00:13:02]:

I had come to Olympia to take a job, a different job, with the Washington Natural Heritage Program, which does an amazing job, monitoring and cataloguing and working to preserve the state’s natural heritage. So rare species, rare ecosystems, high quality ecosystems and this position opened up at state parks and I was encouraged to apply, and it was just a really good fit. I am someone who both really values conservation and protection and care of our natural resources, stewardship of our natural resources and and cultural resource, but natural resources is my is my field and my job as well as being someone who enjoys recreating myself and providing recreational opportunities for other people like introducing people to to nature and and and helping them see just the value of getting out in the outdoors, and so it just seemed like a really great fit.

Scott Cowan [00:14:14]:

Okay. You’re not wearing a park ranger outfit, which is what I expected to stay I’m kidding.

Andrea Thorpe [00:14:21]:

I know. They get they get the cool clothes. They get the hat.

Scott Cowan [00:14:23]:

They get the hats. Yeah.

Andrea Thorpe [00:14:24]:

They get the hat.

Scott Cowan [00:14:25]:

The hat.

Andrea Thorpe [00:14:26]:

Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:14:27]:

The hat. What’s an average day like for you? What’s

Andrea Thorpe [00:14:35]:

There’s no average day. That’s actually one of the things I like about my job. I I guess, luckily, I like variety in my job.

Scott Cowan [00:14:45]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:14:46]:

It let’s see here. The day started off today with talking with some of our planners about some redeveloping some plans for some of our parks in the Southeastern part of the state and what kinds of vegetation communities we have there, what kinds of rare plants or rare plant communities we have there, and, what might the long term management for those plants and plant communities might look like. I had a meeting just before this where I was actually talking with, some individuals from one of the tribes in the state about, some concerns about the impacts of some new development in a park and how that might be impacting the natural resources in a park. Let’s see here. Tomorrow, I’m going out to a park to look at, some of the plant committees and look to see what their condition is and what we can be doing to better monitor and manage them. It varies by hour to hour and day to day.

Scott Cowan [00:15:58]:

Percentage wise, how much of your time is in Olympia?

Andrea Thorpe [00:16:01]:

The vast majority of it. And, unfortunately, the vast majority is spent in front of the computer.

Scott Cowan [00:16:05]:

Okay. Yeah. That’s kinda what I thought the answer was gonna be. So we have about we have over a hundred state parks. Mhmm. You’ve been working for the state parks for about eight years. Right?

Andrea Thorpe [00:16:17]:

I’ve been with state parks for about six years.

Scott Cowan [00:16:19]:

Six years. So how many state parks have you visited?

Andrea Thorpe [00:16:22]:

Oh, jeez. I was keeping a tally for a while and then I stopped. Over half.

Scott Cowan [00:16:29]:

Over half. So okay. For you, the way you like to recreate, you could only go back to one park. What park would you go to? This is your personal, like For

Andrea Thorpe [00:16:46]:

me, the way I like to recreate. Now

Scott Cowan [00:16:50]:

we’re recording this in a in May, so it’s springtime. It might be influenced because it’s May. Right? I’ll give you that.

Andrea Thorpe [00:16:56]:

True. Yeah. Oh, I you know, I

Scott Cowan [00:17:00]:

don’t wanna You should see her folks. She’s sweating. I can tell you she’s sweating.

Andrea Thorpe [00:17:05]:

If so my primary I love to run. I’m a runner. And, so if we’re talking about where would I love to run-in the spring, one of one of I mean, it would be hard to beat somewhere at one of our parks in the gorge, Columbia Hills, or the Klickitat Rail Trail because the wildflower blooms down there in the spring are amazing, and we have great trail systems there. But, you know, there’s so many great parks, and there’s so many it depends on what you wanna do.

Scott Cowan [00:17:41]:

I know. But I’ve I’ve framed this. I pinned you into the corner, and I promise you I wouldn’t, but I I pinned you into the corner because about what you like to do. But as a runner see, I wasn’t even aware. Obviously, if you look at me, I’m not a runner.

Andrea Thorpe [00:17:53]:

But

Scott Cowan [00:17:54]:

I wasn’t even aware there was trails down there. So that’s Mhmm. You’ve you’ve helped educate me even a little bit more. So I I love that idea. Not for me personally, but

Andrea Thorpe [00:18:06]:

One step in front of the other.

Scott Cowan [00:18:09]:

In yeah. Until I clutch my chest and fall down and hope that the ranger knows CPR. I I just I’m I’m I I don’t run so to protect others. How’s that?

Andrea Thorpe [00:18:18]:

Fair enough.

Scott Cowan [00:18:19]:

Yeah. No. And And I know that was a completely unfair question. I I do. And you you danced around it wonderfully. I mean, you really, really did. I let me ask you. Let me let me let me reframe the question.

Scott Cowan [00:18:35]:

I’m gonna ask you the same type of question, but in a different way. If you had half a dozen to a dozen middle school aged kids, what state park do you think they would find interesting? Like, where would you and, you know, it can be more than one, but, like, where do you think what parks got some things that would like, if you were introducing them to nature and, you know, from a want them to be think about getting into the sciences. What pops to mind?

Andrea Thorpe [00:19:10]:

That’s the beautiful thing about the state parks, and that’s that’s the, like, the understated why we’re kind of a big deal part of parks. Like, you know, the the closest parks to me are are relatively small parks that probably most people wouldn’t think of as, you know, destinations. Tolmie State Park, which is right on the Puget Sound, Millersylvania which has you know, it’s on the edge of a little lake. It has some beautiful old trees in it, some wetlands, you know, some really nice trails, and then Lake Sylvia State Park. They’re all relatively small but Mhmm. You get a bunch of kids out there walking around in the forest and letting them you know look look underneath the leaves Mhmm. And look at the critters that are there in the leaves or look at the really cool nets of fungi hypha that are there and talk about, like, the value of those or, you know, have someone who has, you know, the skills to help them, you know, collect some of the invertebrates, the the the critters that are living in the water and look at the diversity of that. Look at the really cool old trees and think about all of the different kinds of animals that are making a living with those with those.

Andrea Thorpe [00:20:39]:

She’s like, there’s something at every park that, you know, or at least nearly every park that I think could really engross a a school of middle school, especially if you have like, we have these amazing interpretive staff at our parks that are so wonderful at telling the stories of the parks and and what’s in them.

Scott Cowan [00:21:06]:

Yeah. I love that. You may have forgotten that you were interviewed. You have a there’s an interview with you on parks.wahoo.gov, and I’m looking at it off off camera. And you do declare your favorite animal here.

Andrea Thorpe [00:21:25]:

I’m trying to remember what I might have written.

Scott Cowan [00:21:27]:

You don’t remember? Oh, that’s funny. Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:21:30]:

Besides my dogs?

Scott Cowan [00:21:32]:

You’re a rough skinned newt.

Andrea Thorpe [00:21:35]:

Oh, well, yeah. I mean, rough skinned newts. I mean, how could you not love? Let’s see. That’s another one. You can’t don’t try to pin me down on, like, a favorite, but No.

Scott Cowan [00:21:46]:

No. No. I I somebody else pinned you

Andrea Thorpe [00:21:48]:

down. That’s true.

Scott Cowan [00:21:49]:

And but I’m looking at this photo, and I don’t see rough skin. I see kind of a slimy creature.

Andrea Thorpe [00:21:56]:

Oh, no. They’re rough. They’re I mean, they’re they’re kind of wet. They’re damp.

Scott Cowan [00:21:59]:

But where do you where where does one find rough skin, newts?

Andrea Thorpe [00:22:04]:

They’re typically found in the forest and, I think rough skinned newts are just in Western Washington. They’re, they they require water for part of their life cycle.

Scott Cowan [00:22:17]:

K.

Andrea Thorpe [00:22:18]:

But then they also live on land, and they’re so cool. They just like to see one, like, walking on a trail.

Scott Cowan [00:22:26]:

So how so this there’s a the picture that’s on the website is is three fingers a thumb and three fingers holding a newt.

Andrea Thorpe [00:22:34]:

Which one?

Scott Cowan [00:22:35]:

It actually looks bigger than I thought it was gonna like, from head to tail, maybe four or five inches?

Andrea Thorpe [00:22:42]:

It seems oh, no. I mean, they can get bigger than that. Okay. They can get up to, like, probably six inches, six to eight inches. Okay. Alright.

Scott Cowan [00:22:52]:

If somebody asked me, what’s Andrea’s favorite animal? That would not have been something I would have ever guessed. Just just just so you know. Just not a gift for a guess that. And you got this love from all of this as a kid while your parents allowed you to explore. And where I’m going with this is I think it’s really cool that people that we all have our different paths that we go down. Right? And you you like to run. Running’s not for me. Things like that.

Scott Cowan [00:23:23]:

And what I where I’m going with this is that, to me, the State Park System has something for everybody.

Andrea Thorpe [00:23:27]:

It really does. Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:23:29]:

It it it it the parks that I’ve been to have been, you know, some have been really quite small and, honestly, I don’t quite get why it’s a state park if I’m, you know

Andrea Thorpe [00:23:39]:

Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:23:40]:

And then there’s some that I go to that are just like, wow. This is this is overwhelming, like, like, so so cool, so beautiful. And I’m grateful that we have them, And I’m I’m grateful that there are people out there that are like yourself who are spend their careers protecting and improving them because I think we probably forget just how much work goes into having these resources available to us. Not that you’re gonna know the answer to this question, but how about how many people work for Washington State Park system?

Andrea Thorpe [00:24:26]:

I don’t know the answer to that question. I would say that it is it is a surprisingly few number of people. Part of the reason why I don’t know the answer is because we hire seasonal park aids to help us out. And and I know that that number increases our ranks quite a bit, and and so I don’t know the that answer. I would say probably oh, gosh, hazarding a guess. For our full time employees, I would say maybe in the two hundreds, but, again, hazarding a guess at that.

Scott Cowan [00:25:07]:

But that’s not that’s not okay. If you do the math, that’s less than two people per park.

Andrea Thorpe [00:25:13]:

Okay. It’s probably a little bit more than that, but, yeah, it’s more than that.

Scott Cowan [00:25:17]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:25:18]:

But, yes, it’s it’s not many, and we have a lot of parks that have where the staff are shared between multiple parks. And, I mean, the people who are out who are out in the parks, the rangers, it is amazing how many hats that it is that they have to wear, because they’re, you know, they’re essentially running little cities with you know, and they’re taking care of, gosh, they’re taking care of, like, their own, like, sewage systems and water systems as well as, you know, the roads and the parking lots and then doing customer service and as well as safety and keeping everyone safe in the parks as well as doing the natural resources management and protection of the archeological and cultural resources in the parks. It’s the number of things that, you know, our our parks have to do. It’s it’s I thought I appreciated it before I started working at parks and then since I’ve been with this agency and I’ve got been made aware of even more of what they do just that my appreciation of that has just magnified.

Scott Cowan [00:26:27]:

I remember as a kid. I don’t know how old I was. Probably not 12, so between eight and 12. My uncle was the park ranger at Flaming Geyser.

Andrea Thorpe [00:26:40]:

Oh, wow.

Scott Cowan [00:26:42]:

And they actually lived there. I I mean, they had there was a a house there, and my my cousin and I, we went out to visit them. And I just remember, I think it was it was snowing and and it was, you know, so it was wintertime. And I just remember that it seemed cool that he was a park ranger. I would guess that his job fifty years ago was very different than a park ranger’s job today. Park systems probably changed a great deal, but it was still kind of, to me, as a young kid, thinking that’s kinda cool.

Andrea Thorpe [00:27:14]:

You know?

Scott Cowan [00:27:14]:

That that’d be kinda cool. And at the same time, something about it as a kid I realized is, like, it almost seemed like you when do you get to leave? I mean, it felt I felt like, you know, it was, you know, he was the family that was they were just there all the time. You know, it was like you had to be at the park at all the time and just how it seemed as a kid. And, yeah, I just think it’s when I talk to people who are park state park enthusiasts, people that use the parks, they they camp there, they take their RVs there. You know, there There’s a lot of people that are very, pleased with our system. Now there’s some complaints, like, it’s hard to get a camping spot sometimes, and I think the system’s a victim of its own success and that, you know, there’s so many of us chasing those those spaces nowadays. Yeah. But I also find just so many people that don’t even really understand that we have state parks.

Scott Cowan [00:28:20]:

Mhmm. It’s just it’s interesting to me. There’s this this segment of the population that consumes the parks, you know, heavy consumers of the park. And then there’s these people that aren’t even aware that close to them is a state park. You know? Like, you just said well, there’s three you know, you basically said three state parks that near you in Olympia. Right? Mhmm. There’s state parks everywhere. Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:28:45]:

Yeah. And and, you know, we don’t I I just would like for us to be aware and go in joy and help utilize so that not to talk funding, but so that funding stays in place. Right? And, you know, and

Andrea Thorpe [00:29:04]:

Oh, yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:29:05]:

But, you know, that the parks are being used and and respected. I mean, don’t go there. I mean, we need to be respectful of the parks too.

Andrea Thorpe [00:29:11]:

Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:29:13]:

Have you been I I wanna know. I’m gonna ask you about one specific park, and I’m gonna call it the wrong name because I can never remember. But it’s the it’s the Cascades At The Palouse Trail that

Andrea Thorpe [00:29:25]:

Oh, yeah. The Palouse to Cascades Trail. Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:29:27]:

Okay. Yeah. Tell me about that. How because when I think of a park, I think of a a land mass. Right? Mhmm. And it’s, you know, the Ocean City State Park, it’s dropped there. Okay. But this this trail is how many miles long, you know, ish, and it’s a trail.

Scott Cowan [00:29:50]:

How come it’s how come it’s a state park?

Andrea Thorpe [00:29:55]:

So that let’s see here. I couldn’t tell you the mileage, but it goes from essentially North Bend, Washington across the state to the Idaho border. There is maybe, like, there’s a little gap in the trail, but it it used to be an old rail line. That’s the the Palouse to Cascades. I guess that’s the the geographic origin. It’s had a couple of different names over time. The Iron Horse Trail, is one of the alternate names for it referring Iron Horse being a train.

Scott Cowan [00:30:35]:

Right.

Andrea Thorpe [00:30:36]:

And so that’s actually one of a couple of old rail trails that we have in our system. So we also have the Willapa Hills Trail, the Columbia Plateau Trail, and the trail on the Klickitat River, and I think they all had their origins as rail trails. And how I I we have history of all of our parks up on our web page, and so those would actually be the best places to go for kind of the history how how they ended up with us. But I would say that, you know, each of those trails provides really important, really valuable recreational opportunities for people whether you wanna do just a section of them or do the whole thing. I know a couple people who’ve ridden the length of the Palouse to Cascades Trail from from North Bend and actually some who’ve gone from North Bend to Missoula, you can do almost the entire thing on old rail trails.

Scott Cowan [00:31:36]:

Oh, really?

Andrea Thorpe [00:31:37]:

Yeah. And Okay. They’ve done that and then taken a train back into Washington, which is pretty cool.

Scott Cowan [00:31:42]:

That’d be kinda fun. I mean, I think it’s really cool. I mean, it’s just I wasn’t it called this probably predates your your involvement. I know it predates your involvement. Wasn’t it the John Wayne Trail, I

Andrea Thorpe [00:31:52]:

think? Yeah. At one point, yeah. It and it still shows up as a John Wayne Trail in some places, and that’s yeah. That we have a an employee, Sam, who’s put together the history of the parks that

Scott Cowan [00:32:02]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:32:02]:

Yeah. That would be the place to go, not not somebody who’s focused on the history. But But one thing I’ll say is that even those trails, like, even though they’re like, you think that it’s just a trail, it’s just a linear trail, we have just a little bit of property. For the most part, just a little bit of property on either side of those roadbeds. Mhmm. Because in a lot of cases, like, there’s other kinds of development on either sides of that. Even along those areas, we have a lot of places where there’s rare plants along the trail that we’re also protecting. So even something like that that you think of as just being so focused on the actual recreation is providing for all of these other benefits that kind of go, you know, unseen.

Scott Cowan [00:32:48]:

On that specific park, this might not be this once again, might not be a question that’s directly in your your wheelhouse, but might be. How does the how does the so there’s a park ranger for that, and and maybe they’re doing park ranger duty. Or is there do you know is there more than one ranger for that? Because it’s so such a long trail.

Andrea Thorpe [00:33:08]:

Yeah. They they it’s split up between a couple different areas.

Scott Cowan [00:33:11]:

Okay. So ranger a might be managing from, let’s say, North Bend to Cle Elum and also managing some other park somewhere in the in the Cascades. Okay. And then ranger b’s maybe doing it from Cle Elum to Moses Lake area. And then there’s ranger c’s from there down into the Idaho state border. What what are they doing? Are they what what what would a park ranger’s job be on a on a trail like that? And I’m I’m saying that because like you said earlier, like, they’re managing, like, the the septic and all of this stuff. But on a trail system, are they are they going oh, are they I don’t wanna say patrolling. That’s not the right word.

Scott Cowan [00:33:56]:

But are they going and checking out their segment of the trail to make sure that the the trail’s in good repair, that somebody isn’t dump something there. Yep. Things like that. And so

Andrea Thorpe [00:34:07]:

Yeah. And, you know, I think especially when there’s, you know, a lot of, you know, higher recreation area areas like, you know, helping to manage for visitor safety. They are doing assessments of invasive species along the trails, because those are definitely corridors and we don’t want, you know, the weeds to be going into, you know, the agricultural properties that are adjacent to the trails. So they’re documenting those and, working with, you know, my staff are helping to control those noxious weeds, where if we’ve got fences, you know, adjacent to the trail, we’re, you know, looking to see the status of those and working with the neighbors on that, looking for things that be could be causing fire danger or, you know, if there’s been a fire looking to see if, the trees that have burned, if they could be causing any, impacts to human, you know, safety. So, there’s still a lot of kind of issues around, around that manage management that’s important.

Scott Cowan [00:35:17]:

Okay. I was recently kinda doing a little reading about, Fort Casey, Fort Flagler and Fort Worden, the triangle of fire, parks, and how after World War Two, they were I don’t wanna say given. I don’t know if that’s the right word, but they in the fifties, they became part of the Washington State Parks Network. How do these parks typically become state parks?

Andrea Thorpe [00:35:51]:

There’s a wide variety of ways. Some of them were essentially given to us by the federal government. Some of them are actually still underlying owned by the federal government, and we’re managing

Scott Cowan [00:36:06]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:36:06]:

The parks for them.

Scott Cowan [00:36:07]:

Can you give me an example of one that way like that?

Andrea Thorpe [00:36:12]:

Several of the parks that we have along the Columbia River are, are owned by the Army Corps of Engineers, and we’re we’re managing the recreation and the natural resources on them.

Scott Cowan [00:36:24]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:36:25]:

Yep. Let’s see here. Some of the parks are parks that we have acquired. So, we have, identified an opportunity to provide recreation or natural culture resources management and that we have pursued grant funding to acquire those and for them to become part of the park system.

Scott Cowan [00:36:49]:

Okay. So are you familiar with Olmstead?

Andrea Thorpe [00:36:53]:

Mhmm. Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:36:54]:

So that was a working farm. Right?

Andrea Thorpe [00:36:56]:

It it was. Yep.

Scott Cowan [00:36:57]:

Right. So do you know I know that well, I’m asking you very specific questions that aren’t necessarily a wheelhouse, but, since that was a a working farm and, obviously an arrangement was made where it became a a state park.

Andrea Thorpe [00:37:13]:

Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:37:14]:

Is that a common method that the a private owner would work with the state to take the take some resources and and put them into the state’s care?

Andrea Thorpe [00:37:28]:

It’s, I’m not sure how common it is, but, yeah, there have definitely been cases where, private landowners have and I think especially probably more in the past, but when there’s been, an opportunity where they’ve approached parks, whether it’s been as a donation or as something that they’re asking whether or not we have interest or capacity to take on.

Scott Cowan [00:37:56]:

Well, that’s the that’s the other part of it is the the ability to take it on. You might we might all love for it to be a state park, but do you does the the department have the bandwidth to to manage it?

Andrea Thorpe [00:38:08]:

Right. I mean, everything’s gonna end up with an additional cost to it. Right. Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:38:15]:

What do you you in your opinion, what do you see in the next five years happening in our park system around the state? I mean, are we are we, I’m joking, are we gonna get Wi Fi at every state park? I hope not. But, you know, are we is this gonna be, you know, are we anyway, is there are there things on the horizon that are being looked at to for our parks?

Andrea Thorpe [00:38:45]:

Yeah. Well, this is, if you had asked me this question about a year ago, my my answer might be different. I think right now, for those who have this is this gonna, like, time stamp this this interview, but, the state of Washington is in a bit of a tight budget situation, and so it’s affecting all agencies, including state parks. And so I think, you know, right now, we are going to be doing our best to keep just providing

Scott Cowan [00:39:18]:

Mhmm. A

Andrea Thorpe [00:39:19]:

positive experience for the visitors and not allowing degradation of the natural and cultural resources that are under our care and, you know, do our our best at that. I don’t see an expansion of that in the next couple of years just because of the challenges that we’re facing that way. Not to be kind of negative about that, but, you know, I think that we are always looking to see what what can we do to just improve on all those aspects. Like, what can we do to improve on, you know, visitor experience in the parks, making things easier for people to reserve a campsite. Like, we I know we just provide a new way for people to find and reserve a campsite, like, the same on the same day. We’re working to build, you know, a new state park, Nisqually State Park on the way to Mount Rainier, and that’s gonna continue to go on. We’re looking at other places where we could potentially be adding more campsites or adding additional recreational facilities. At the same time, we we still have, like, that core mission of, you know, protecting the natural and cultural resources.

Andrea Thorpe [00:40:41]:

So, yeah, I think that’s all going to continue while we’re also trying to provide that, you know, those memorable recreational experiences and also trying to, you know, hopefully, get into a better budgetary situation in the future.

Scott Cowan [00:40:58]:

Approximately. How many people visit our state parks annually?

Andrea Thorpe [00:41:04]:

You keep asking me questions I don’t know the answer to.

Scott Cowan [00:41:07]:

That’s okay. I mean, we because I think also it’s probably impossible to really, like, give account to it because if somebody pulls into Squilchuck State Park, which is by me, which is one of those state parks, and I’m like, I’m not quite sure why it’s no offense, Squilchuck State Park. There’s not a lot there. And so somebody might pull in, which means they’re, in my opinion, they’re using the state park, you know, and they’re but they might leave quickly. But it’s gotta be a a very large number of of people.

Andrea Thorpe [00:41:40]:

Yeah. And, you know, some parks like Deception Pass State Park that that that park receives thousands and thousands of visitors each year. Right. And and that’s our most highly visited park.

Scott Cowan [00:41:55]:

That’s okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:41:56]:

And it is it is, I mean, it’s if you’ve been there, it’s clear to see why. It is a beautiful park. It is close to Seattle, relatively speaking. It it, yeah, it’s stunning. It it kinda checks all the boxes, you know, and yeah. And then we’ve got parks that are smaller that provide fewer kind of recreational or, you know, fewer opportunities, but, you know, even Squilchuck, that has some great trails going through the forest there. It has a really cool old lodge. It’s got,

Scott Cowan [00:42:29]:

Is the lodge part of the park?

Andrea Thorpe [00:42:31]:

The lodge is part of the park. Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:42:33]:

I see that’s I think I think locally, we’re a little there’s a confusion about that.

Andrea Thorpe [00:42:37]:

Oh, yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:42:38]:

Good to know. Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:42:39]:

Yep.

Scott Cowan [00:42:40]:

Alright. So Deception Pass is the most visited. Mhmm. Honestly, I would’ve thought maybe Cape Disappointment.

Andrea Thorpe [00:42:51]:

It’s up there. Cape Disappointment is definitely up there.

Scott Cowan [00:42:54]:

So what are, like, what are some of the okay. So we what are some of the other well visited, you know Mhmm. Largely visited parks?

Andrea Thorpe [00:43:03]:

Largely visited parks. Mount Spokane and Riverside State Parks, which are both just outside of Spokane. Probably, which is just outside of Bellingham, that gets a lot of use because it’s practically in the backyard of the city of Bellingham. So, I think it’s a it it gets a lot of locals use. The forts that you mentioned, Fort Casey, Fort Ebey, Fort Wharton are all very popular parks. Trying to go through the checklist. Yeah. Those are the ones that really stick out, and then we’ve got, probably Moran State Park.

Andrea Thorpe [00:43:43]:

It’s a little harder to get to since it’s on Orcas Island, but it’s probably up there right. In the numbers as well.

Scott Cowan [00:43:48]:

Right. And that and somebody’s gotta work to get there. I mean, that’s a that’s a commitment to either the Yeah. Because just yeah. no shade on the ferry system, but it the San Juans in my entire lifetime, like, you know, going to the San Juans during the summer has always been you have to think about it.

Andrea Thorpe [00:44:09]:

It it it requires some planning for sure. Sure.

Scott Cowan [00:44:11]:

It does. It really does. But it’s beautiful up there. It’s absolutely worth the planning in

Andrea Thorpe [00:44:16]:

my opinion. Well, in the Seashore Conservation Area, actually, that probably that is a very well but, you know, that’s one we don’t really keep numbers on, but anytime someone meant, you know, wanders on the beaches on the coast that’s visiting a state park.

Scott Cowan [00:44:28]:

Okay. Gonna ask you another hard question. Okay. So you’ve been to about half of them. Mhmm. What park that you haven’t been to do you wanna go to? Like, what’s on the list that you wanna go check it check it out?

Andrea Thorpe [00:44:41]:

Yeah. Oh, jeez.

Scott Cowan [00:44:45]:

Have you been to all the ones we just kinda mentioned? Have you been to to Moran? Have you been to Mhmm. Have you been to Fort Flagler, Casey, Worden? Yep.

Andrea Thorpe [00:44:53]:

I’ve been yep. Been to all of those.

Scott Cowan [00:44:55]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:44:56]:

Been to the pass quite a few times.

Scott Cowan [00:44:58]:

Have you been to Mount Spokane?

Andrea Thorpe [00:45:01]:

I’ve been to Mount Spokane, been to Riverside.

Scott Cowan [00:45:03]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:45:04]:

I’ve, I let’s say oh, gosh. Let’s see. I don’t wanna offend anyone by saying

Scott Cowan [00:45:13]:

No. Just what pops into your head? Give me you can give me more than one. I’m just curious.

Andrea Thorpe [00:45:17]:

You know, there’s some of the, some of the parks in the islands in in in the Puget Sound that I that require a boat Mhmm. That aren’t serviced by the fair I haven’t been to that I’m I’m interested in going there, just because the, the vegetation there is different. And, on each of the islands, like, each island is almost like this its own little unique place, and I’d really like to visit that.

Scott Cowan [00:45:46]:

And it sounds it sounds like you kinda geek out on that, though. That’s that’s

Andrea Thorpe [00:45:49]:

Well, I mean

Scott Cowan [00:45:50]:

And that’s a compliment now.

Andrea Thorpe [00:45:52]:

Negative. Spend a large portion of my life getting degrees in setting nature. So especially plants. So yeah. Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:46:03]:

I’ve been to Moran. I haven’t been to Mount Spokane or Riverside. And Riverside looks interesting to me.

Andrea Thorpe [00:46:16]:

Yeah. Why does it look interesting to you?

Scott Cowan [00:46:17]:

I don’t know. We’ve on our website, we’ve we’ve had some content written about it, and there’s some bridges that go across the river. And they just they just kinda captivated me like, oh, that looks cool. I wanna go check that out type of thing.

Andrea Thorpe [00:46:31]:

And So what interests you about parks? Like, what draws you to a park? Yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:46:35]:

It’s a good question. And this is gonna reflect on so I grew up on the West Side of the state, so I grew up, you know, with the with the green. Right? So things that you know, trees and that have moss hanging off them, things like that. Alright? I but I kinda like the water. I I I like I like water. And so parks that are near water probably draw me the most. I’m I’m not a particularly active person, so, like, hiking and climbing and all that doesn’t doesn’t I appreciate it, but I’m probably not gonna participate in it. So I’m, you know, I’m more sedentary.

Scott Cowan [00:47:17]:

Not really painting a good picture about myself, am I? But I I really wanted I really wanna go check out the Cascades to the Police Trail. I because I see that when I’m driving through Central Washington and when I come over Snoqualmie Pass, and it just there’s a couple of train overpasses that have the signs on it. I’m kind of

Andrea Thorpe [00:47:37]:

It’d be cool. Cool to

Scott Cowan [00:47:38]:

walk across that. I that that is one that’s kind of caught my attention in the last couple of years.

Andrea Thorpe [00:47:44]:

So if you wanna go to that trail and experience the trail and also experience water and bridges, we just recently redid the Beverly Bridge, which goes across the Columbia River.

Scott Cowan [00:47:56]:

So in Wanapum, basically, isn’t it? Mhmm. Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:47:59]:

Yeah. And it’s it is a pedestrian and bike only bridge

Scott Cowan [00:48:04]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:48:04]:

That goes across the river. And, you know, and then you can hike the trail as much as you want to on on either side. But it’s it’s a really cool experience to be, like, standing in the middle of the bridge and looking up the Columbia River and down the Columbia River. And, if you’re into history and geology at all, you can look down to the, you know, the gap where the, back, when glaciers Mhmm. You know, filled, you know, much of the Western US, and, you know, there’s a glacial lake in the Missoula Basin. Mhmm. You can look down to see the gap or when the big ice dam would break and the floodwaters from that glacial Lake Missoula would be released. They would rush down the Columbia River and then they would get caught it at this gap that isn’t it’s like this little narrowing and then all of those waters would back up and then they would back up and that’s what, you know, scoured out a lot of the areas around Ginkgo State Park, but then they would deposit all of that beautiful, silty soil, that, created what is now, you know, such an abundant agricultural area, you know, the blue seals of of Washington state, but also, you know, we used to have amazing prairies that covered Eastern Washington that we still have at, like, Steptoe Butte State Park, that provides habitat like, protection for the large remaining chunk of of Prairie, Police Prairie, in the state of Washington, and that’s oh my gosh.

Andrea Thorpe [00:49:51]:

That in the springtime is so gorgeous. So yeah. So you should go there. You should go to the Beverly Bridge.

Scott Cowan [00:49:58]:

I I will. I actually I I will, and I will report back to you. I’ll take a photo from it,

Andrea Thorpe [00:50:03]:

of course. It’s good. Okay.

Scott Cowan [00:50:05]:

The the other park and I told you this on the phone when we talked. The other park that I was because this is a story from my childhood or or my mother told me from her childhood. Right? But I was a year ago spring, so not this spring, but last spring. I was up at Lake Curlew, and I thought what I thought, what a really cool I’m joking when I say in the middle of nowhere, but it’s pretty close. It’s just slightly off the middle of nowhere. It’s it’s remote. But it was as I pulled in and you drive down off the the I’ll call it a highway. That’s being generous.

Scott Cowan [00:50:39]:

But it’s, you know, you drive in off of it, and you meander your way down switch back as you get close. And I was driving around, and I there’s all these picnic spots and camping spots with the view of the lake, really wonderful views. And I got out, and I was walking around. And what I what struck me was how really nicely maintained the park was. And I don’t mean it looked like Augusta National putting greens and all that, but it was it was well maintained while still looking natural.

Andrea Thorpe [00:51:11]:

Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:51:11]:

Okay? And the camping area for the RVs was was probably 70% full. This is during the middle of the week. And the people there were I I stopped to use the restroom and and people, hey.

Andrea Thorpe [00:51:25]:

How are

Scott Cowan [00:51:25]:

you doing? How’s everything going? You having a good time staying here? I mean, it was just this friendly people that we’re having. You could just tell they were very pleased to be there in this this really beautiful spot. Have you been to Lake Carlow?

Andrea Thorpe [00:51:41]:

I haven’t. So it’s that I need to put them on the list?

Scott Cowan [00:51:44]:

Yeah. No. It was really it was really this relaxing, pleasant place to be. And Yeah. I that would work for me If I Nice. You know, that would work for my idea of camping, though, is bad room service. So I I I would need a I would need an, you know, an RV or something like that. Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:52:03]:

And that almost seems no offense to anybody that’s an RV person, and a lot of my friends are RV people. That almost seems like it’s cheating in some ways. But but the the point is, I think what I would like the listeners to kind of take away from this whole conversation is is one that the Snowy Plover needs needs our attention. Or, actually, it needs us to ignore it.

Andrea Thorpe [00:52:27]:

Right.

Scott Cowan [00:52:27]:

But we need to be aware of it so we can ignore it. But also that this that the state has an abundance and an incredibly wide range of parks. Mhmm. And that there’s a team of people that are probably overworked. Plug for your boss there. She’s overworked. No. But, you know, I mean, it’s like you said, the budget is what it is.

Scott Cowan [00:52:47]:

I mean, that’s nothing you and I can control. Yep. But we should make sure we appreciate and utilize these parks respectfully so that that the evidence is there that they’re being that they’re valuable.

Andrea Thorpe [00:53:02]:

Yeah. K. And we do. We have something for everyone. Yep. We’ve got deserts, marine environments, mountains, forests, water. It’s yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:53:14]:

And that’s the thing. When when people think of Washington state that aren’t necessarily from here, they think it’s rainy and and dreary and green. Right? And, really, yes, it is. But it also is high desert.

Andrea Thorpe [00:53:29]:

Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:53:30]:

You know, we’ve got prairies. We’ve got, you know, you can drive around the state and see a myriad of things. It’s just you you can’t in a lot of other places in the in the in the country or in the world. So I appreciate your time talking about the state parks, and I’m I’m I’m grateful that you are passionate about things like the the rough skinned newt I’m questioning you on that one, but, you know, we’ll let you be.

Andrea Thorpe [00:53:55]:

They’re so cute.

Scott Cowan [00:53:57]:

Why do you say that?

Andrea Thorpe [00:53:59]:

They’re they’re just they’re just why okay. Why do I love I mean, they’re cute. I find I find them aesthetically pleasing. Okay. They’re also just like the way that they walk is just it’s really it’s it’s almost comical.

Scott Cowan [00:54:18]:

Okay.

Andrea Thorpe [00:54:19]:

They’re also they are they are a species that is associated with places that I like, that are my heart places. You know? Like, you see them in in, I mean, it doesn’t have have to be a pristine force, but, you know, there are species that you find walking down a trail in a forest and, and I guess are some of the places where I first form my affinity for Alright. What it is that I do. So there’s probably a lot of reasons, but they they’re I find them aesthetically pleasing. I think they’re cute. Alright.

Scott Cowan [00:55:06]:

I didn’t mean to put you on the spot,

Andrea Thorpe [00:55:07]:

but okay.

Scott Cowan [00:55:10]:

As we wrap this up, I gotta ask you some questions. I ask all my guests these these questions. But so you’re based in Olympia, so these are very important. I’m a coffee fan. So I need to know, in your opinion, where’s a great place to get coffee in in Olympia?

Andrea Thorpe [00:55:30]:

So, I’m going to maybe not quite answer your question, but the great place to get coffee is to go down to the farmer’s market on Saturdays. Mhmm. And there’s a relatively new little vendor there called Owl and Cedar Homestead. That’s what I’m drinking right now. Is there it’s like a micro micro brew like, not brewery, but coffee roaster. And they roast their own beans, and they sell them at the farmer’s market in a few places in, I think, Centralia or Chehalis area. Okay. And they’re just a wonderful, lovely couple that is doing an amazing job roasting beans.

Andrea Thorpe [00:56:10]:

It’s really tasty, and they do it all sustainably. And, so I really appreciate that as well. So that’s go get yourself some beans and then make yourself some coffee.

Scott Cowan [00:56:23]:

Alright. So I’m putting you on the spot. So you’re drinking their coffee now.

Andrea Thorpe [00:56:26]:

Mhmm. How

Scott Cowan [00:56:27]:

did you prepare the coffee?

Andrea Thorpe [00:56:30]:

French press.

Scott Cowan [00:56:31]:

French press. What what is the blend? What what type of what are you drinking? What is it? Is it a a dark roast, a light roast medium? What do you what do you what do you

Andrea Thorpe [00:56:41]:

can what do you drink instead? And I actually I drink half caf. So I make my own. Yeah. So they have both a water processed decaf and then a dark roast that I combine.

Scott Cowan [00:56:53]:

Okay. Solid. Solid. And you do French press?

Andrea Thorpe [00:56:55]:

I do French press.

Scott Cowan [00:56:56]:

Have you ever tried an Aeropress?

Andrea Thorpe [00:56:59]:

I have tried an Aeropress. That makes a good cup of coffee as

Scott Cowan [00:57:02]:

well. That’s that’s my go to at home.

Andrea Thorpe [00:57:03]:

Oh, yeah.

Scott Cowan [00:57:03]:

So you’re you’re liking that. So half caf French roast or not French roast necessarily, but French press but dark coffee.

Andrea Thorpe [00:57:09]:

French fries. So

Scott Cowan [00:57:12]:

it’s around lunchtime when we’re recording this, and we’re talking coffee. You mentioned the Farmer’s market. I’m getting hungry. Where’s a where’s a interesting place great place for lunch in Olympia?

Andrea Thorpe [00:57:24]:

Go to the Nineveh, a Syrian. They have a a brick and mortar restaurant now, but I would say go to the Nineveh, a Syrian food truck that’s down on Plum And Fourth Street. And they it’s, kinda Middle Eastern food. They make the most, amazing food. And get yourself some takeout from Nineveh, and then you drive just a little ways down Northpointe. It it’s just a little ways down, and it’s like this point for the the port that goes out into into the sound, and maybe there’s some tables, picnic benches that you can just sit there and eat your amazing food truck provided food overlooking the sound.

Scott Cowan [00:58:13]:

What would you be ordering there?

Andrea Thorpe [00:58:16]:

There’s a beach. They have this wrap that has this, like, eggplant and, Baba ghanoush and hard boiled egg and pickled veggies and oh my gosh. That sounds

Scott Cowan [00:58:31]:

that sounds really good.

Andrea Thorpe [00:58:32]:

It is so good.

Scott Cowan [00:58:33]:

Alright. I warned you about this question. Remember? Mhmm. Refreshing your memory.

Andrea Thorpe [00:58:40]:

Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [00:58:41]:

K. You agreed to play along?

Andrea Thorpe [00:58:43]:

I did.

Scott Cowan [00:58:44]:

Did you cheat and listen to any of the end of any of the other episodes?

Andrea Thorpe [00:58:47]:

I might have looked. You did. But I still don’t have a good answer for you.

Scott Cowan [00:58:53]:

Well, okay. So the question is cake or pie and why?

Andrea Thorpe [00:58:58]:

Yeah. See, if you haven’t figured it out already, I hate being, like, having to choose between

Scott Cowan [00:59:04]:

I know.

Andrea Thorpe [00:59:05]:

Things.

Scott Cowan [00:59:05]:

I understand, but you’re going to.

Andrea Thorpe [00:59:12]:

I would say whichever has been prepared the best. But, so see, I’m a snob when it comes to food. And so, like, if it’s, like, the choice between, like, just kind of a fluffy airy meh cake or, like, a good piece of pie, I’m gonna choose the pie.

Scott Cowan [00:59:28]:

So so alright. I’m gonna give you some new parameters, some updated parameters. So it’s probably gonna make it harder for you. Both are prepared the way you like them. So you get a well prepared cake

Andrea Thorpe [00:59:37]:

Okay.

Scott Cowan [00:59:38]:

Or a well prepared pie.

Andrea Thorpe [00:59:40]:

Yeah. I’m gonna probably go cake.

Scott Cowan [00:59:44]:

You are. Okay. What type of cake?

Andrea Thorpe [00:59:48]:

So I typically like, let’s see here. I typically like something with chocolate in it. K. And I typically like it’s like character. I don’t like just, like, fluff and air and for it to be sweet for the case of being sweet. That’s why it’s, you know, like, a hard question for me to answer.

Scott Cowan [01:00:07]:

That’s okay. I mean, some people really, really struggle with it. Some people are like, I mean, camp camp cake, and you can’t you can’t just wait

Andrea Thorpe [01:00:14]:

for me. You know? And then but then I think of, like, oh my gosh. An amazing piece of, like, Marionberry or, like, blackberry pie if so she’s made out of, like, local native blackberries. Oh, it’s so good. So that’s

Scott Cowan [01:00:30]:

So as a child, I’m this is this is my follow-up question that I I I’m asking this question, and so far, the answers haven’t been what I expected. But as a child, did your did your did either of your parents were they did they bake cakes? Were they did they make pies? What did you grow up in your household?

Andrea Thorpe [01:00:48]:

Well, I’m I am a kid who grew up in the eighties. And so, you know, back then, it was the making a cake out of a box. And then my mom had the cookbook where, like, you made all sorts of fun shapes

Scott Cowan [01:01:00]:

Mhmm. Mhmm.

Andrea Thorpe [01:01:01]:

Out of the the box cake, you know, by, like, cutting you know, not not not what you see on, like, the Food Network now. Right. No. No. Yeah. Yeah. No. Yeah.

Andrea Thorpe [01:01:09]:

So that’s that’s what

Scott Cowan [01:01:10]:

I think. With cake though.

Andrea Thorpe [01:01:11]:

I grew up with cake.

Scott Cowan [01:01:12]:

See, my my premise and it’s not and I still think I’m right, but so far my sample sizes are disagreeing with me. I think what we grew up with as kids influences our choice between cake or pie. So if you my my premise is you so you said you grew up in a cake household, which you’re kind of

Andrea Thorpe [01:01:31]:

Yeah. I understand.

Scott Cowan [01:01:32]:

Yeah. Helping me. Yeah. But most people say, no. No. That’s not it. And it’s almost like it’s almost like they’re rebelling from the childhood. I grew up with pie, so I like cake or, you know, it’s it’s just interesting to me that it Yeah.

Scott Cowan [01:01:44]:

It’s such a you know, I stole this question from another show, and I I just thought I just run with it because I think it’s kind of fun. You know? It’s because there’s no wrong answer other well, there is there is one wrong answer. Pumpkin pie is wrong. I don’t care how you slice it. Pumpkin pie is wrong.

Andrea Thorpe [01:01:59]:

Oh, you sound like you’ve been traumatized.

Scott Cowan [01:02:01]:

I I have stories. I have stories. And I’ve shared it before, but really quickly. So, my grandmother, Thanksgiving every year, she would, you know, cook this wonderful Thanksgiving meal in every year. Do you want pumpkin pie? No. Thank you. Well, I don’t like pumpkin pie. Since when? I mean, every year, it was like Wow.

Scott Cowan [01:02:22]:

It was so it was almost kind I I think looking back on it that maybe she was pulling my leg after a while, but she did remember which is making it because I would just get Mhmm. Anyway, yeah, pumpkin pie is not no. Not my thing.

Andrea Thorpe [01:02:39]:

Interesting.

Scott Cowan [01:02:40]:

No. And I’m really surprised. Most guests and I need to go back. What I need to do is go back through all the episodes and, like, tabulate the answers. Yeah. But most people don’t say pumpkin pie. I’m really grateful for that. I feel like I It’s like people that go to Costco and they they walk out with a giant, you know Mhmm.

Scott Cowan [01:03:00]:

Pizza sized pumpkin pie from Costco, like, they’re proud. I’m like, no. Don’t

Andrea Thorpe [01:03:04]:

be proud.

Scott Cowan [01:03:04]:

Don’t be proud of that.

Andrea Thorpe [01:03:05]:

Not gonna do that. Alright.

Scott Cowan [01:03:09]:

What are you gonna do last question. What are you gonna do when we’re recording this, it’s it’s be the week before Memorial Day, so you have a three day weekend. Mhmm. Are you gonna get outside? Are you gonna go and do something in nature on a on this holiday weekend?

Andrea Thorpe [01:03:26]:

Yes.

Scott Cowan [01:03:26]:

What are you gonna go do?

Andrea Thorpe [01:03:28]:

I am going to hopefully go for some nice walks with my husband and my dogs. Probably go for a run-in the woods with a friend or two. And other than that, we’ve got a little tiny bit of property that needs some attention. And so, not quite I mean, it’s a different way of being out in nature, but I still enjoy getting my hands in dirt.

Scott Cowan [01:03:58]:

Alright. Well, Andrew, thank you so much for sitting down with me today. I am glad that the state is looking after endangered plant and animal species. I think I think I will say this, and this isn’t meant to be a criticism, but I think you guys should do more to get that out to the public. K? And however we can help, please let me know. But I’m grateful that you that that the state is doing that. I appreciate your time. I think it’s fascinating that you like nudes.

Scott Cowan [01:04:32]:

I’m just teasing you. Sorry. The picture’s right here. I can’t stop

Andrea Thorpe [01:04:35]:

looking at it.

Scott Cowan [01:04:37]:

And, but, no, in all seriousness, I I think that I’m grateful that the Washington State Parks is is available to us all. I’m grateful that they are is the variety that we have, and I think we need to, like, be more mindful of that opportunity that we, as residents of the state or of the region that are visiting the state, we have all these opportunities, and we’re really lucky to have that.

Andrea Thorpe [01:05:05]:

Thank you. I appreciate the time and the interest.